T O P
im0497

I still remember my father ordering this fight and inviting my uncles over in hopes that Margs would somehow trap and TKO Manny. Needless to say, those hopes ended after the 4th round.


JosePawz

Same, Mexican family was all ready for Margarito to get a KO even though they knew Pacquiao was just the better fighter


im0497

The only way Margs would beat Manny at that point would be if you cut one of Pac's legs off and even then, it's a 50/50 fight. Margs just wasn't that good at cutting off the ring.


[deleted]

Interesting Fact: After beating Margarito at a 150 lbs catchweight and winning the vacant belt, the WBC was gonna order Manny Pacquiao to defend his WBC belt vs Canelo Alvarez. Pacquiao vacated the belt instead and fought a 39yr old Shane Mosley who has a record of 2W-2L-1D in his last 5 fights prior to fighting Manny. Canelo then fought Matthew Hatton for the belt that Pacquiao vacated.


NotSeeingRace

Pacquiao's interview of him explaining why he vacated is hilarious. Basically he realized the 154 guys punch way harder and he didn't want any of it anymore. He apparently stayed in bed for a few days in pain after the fight. Margarito was enough.


guesswhodat

Brutal honesty. He’s not even a welterweight. Maybe a lightweight. To go against these bigger guys and beat them handily is a testament to size of Manny’s cojones.


0JS

Very reasonable. Most 154s are boiled down middleweights anyway.


Mecha_Knight11

This is why people that invalidate this fight because it was in a catchweight are dumb. This took a lot out of Pacquiao, he got hit less but the damage was bigger.


Mecha_Knight11

["No, nevermind give it to them"](https://youtu.be/ev-Wp1mJzxo) Lmao


ItsHeero

At least he's honest.


acslaytaa

Wasn’t that down to Margarito caking his wraps in something similar to cement powder iirc?


lord-of-war-1

Who do you think punches harder? Canelo or Margarito?


BinaryGoon

Canelo 1000%


lord-of-war-1

Exactly, by quite a bit too. He is much heavier and also alot more accurate than Margarito. This would be a pretty unethical matchup.


[deleted]

But y’all criticize mayweather for fighting at catch weight when Pacquiao wouldn’t even step In the ring with canelo it wasn’t hilarious you’re just making a fanboy excuse


NotSeeingRace

Wow really bringing in Mayweather out of nowhere. Truly a Mayweather fanboy lmao. You do realize that Pac is fighting above his weight even at 147? Even more at 154. He might have ended up comatose if he kept fighting at 154. Mayweather catch weight with Canelo was reasonable in my opinion.


[deleted]

He ducked canelo when he could of clearly fought him, Mayweather didn’t simple, i don’t care about any excuses


NotSeeingRace

I mean yeah he did basically duck Canelo and the whole 154 division. No shame in that. Even Manny isn't making excuses. He admits he gave the belt away. He couldn't handle the power with his frame. Though I believe he had good reasons to leave the division.


[deleted]

I respect mannys craft I just hate his fans lol


Immediate-Climate499

Damn, Pacquiao vs Canelo in 2011. I got into boxing a couple of years later, so I didn't get to watch Canelo's early career. Who do you think would've won then?


CacoFlaco

Canelo was still a green kid 11 years ago. Pacquiao wins.


[deleted]

Manny beats him.


MikeyNapoli

Agree. Too fast and experienced. Canelo still very green.


_Tuxalonso

Do you think the theoretical experience vs an all time great in Manny could have altered his performance vs Mayweather? I know this is neck deep in what ifs but I'm interested in people's opinion on this one.


mariotx10

No. Manny beats your with speed and power, you get your ass whooped but there’s nothing much else you can do. Mayweather beats you with high iq, that shit makes you feel stupid and fucks with your head for a bit


_Tuxalonso

I ask because the common talking point is that Canelo improved greatly because of his fight with Mayweather. Food for thought though, thanks for a well thought response


Stiltzkinn

Would have been a different and close fight, even if Floyd gets the win Pac is a midget in welterweight so he gets the credit for fighting a top 10 ATG.


guesswhodat

In 2011 absolutely.


Spyder-xr

Pacquiao would’ve Margarito’d Canelo


delukard

Or canelo would have marquez'd paquiao... KTFO IN 6


rodka209

2011 canelo did not have the offensive or defensive game he does now. Also, he was smaller as well at the time. Pac with a decision or maybe late TKO, maybe. But also, that Margarito fight took a LOT out of Pac. I'm not sure if it was his training, his personal life, plus the fact Margarito got his own clean shots in as well, but you could tell that despite the clear victory, there was a toll on him afterwards.


Wavepops

canelo was too big, if a shell of Margarito had Manny fucked up like you said then of course young canelo who hits harder would have Manny fucked up. I mean match up 2011 canelo and that marg who wins? pretty clear. and its not like I think canelo is some god or something


rodka209

I remember Margarito being a live dog still at that year. I need to rewatch what canelo was like during that time, but he was developing still. I think that's the year he took on Hattons brother or miguel cottos brother and both seemed to be step up "name" fights for him.


Wavepops

Margarito took a tuneup before the pac fight and looked like shell of himself, doesnt take away from what Manny did, but green canelo is gonna be a tougher challenge than what Margarito was at that point. People still thought Margarito was still within the same realm of what we expect from him, but he was cooked


SSLurker0

Marga-cheato was never the same after he was exposed.


KADOMONY-9000

Nah. Canelo is gonna get Bivol'ed if he fought Pac in 2011.


Wavepops

Pac didn’t do that Margarito who was washed already


KADOMONY-9000

Pac did.


Wavepops

pac said he was fucked up after that fight despite the win, do you think bivol felt like after beating canelo? mans said the only thing was bothering him was his arm. pac was pissing blood apparently


[deleted]

These people on here are delusional fan boys they’ll say anything to make themselves fill better about Pacquiao


lord-of-war-1

Canelo wallops him. There are weight classes for a reason. And there is a reason Pac fought a career 147 pounder for a 154 pound title, at 150.


rice_ant

These pac boy fans don’t wanna hear the truth , if it was an easy fight like they say it is then why didn’t he fight him , canelos size and power would of gave pac fits , doubt it would be a ko


lord-of-war-1

Oh it would be a KO. Stylistically, Canelo has the advantage. He struggles with defensive fighters that know how to fight from range. Guys that come straight a him, like Pac would, usually get brutalized. Not to mention the 15 pound advantage Canelo would have on fight night.


Mecha_Knight11

Agree but a canelo win by a landslide no, of course Canelo's power and weight will definitely punish Manny but experience and chin of Manny plays a part too, and Prime Manny has a tough chin just ask Erik Morales. it will be close but Manny will definitely slow down by the late rounds but I think he'll survive and probably win but we'll never get the legendary second half of Manny's career cause this fight will slow him down by a lot. Unless he gets super aggressive like Pac-Marquez 4 then I don't think he'll be KO'ed specially by a young Canelo. Edit: If you watch the interview Manny says that he could take the punches, what he could not take was the damage that accumulates after the fight.


lord-of-war-1

Who do you think punches harder? Marquez or Canelo?


Mecha_Knight11

Canelo, But I know where you're going and it's not the same. You know what they say styles make fights and Marquez was tailored for Pacquiao and as I said unless Manny gets super aggressive in this hypothetical matchup then I don't think he'll be KO'ed by a young Canelo.


lord-of-war-1

Both guys are counter punchers that feed off agressive fighters? Canelo is also taller and longer than Pac. So you are saying Manny is going to outbox Canelo without putting himself at risk? When did Manny become a slick defensive fighter?


Mecha_Knight11

Bro did you read my first reply, I said I agree with you. What I disagree with is Canelo winning by KO or a lopsided decision. If Pacquiao replaces Mayweather during that time Floyd fought him, a young canelo would have the fight of his life against Manny. Keyword: YOUNG. Now prime Canelo is a very very very different story. And Marquez took 4 fights to land that beautiful counterpunch, I don't think young Canelo will Unless, as I said again, if Manny fights really aggressive.


lord-of-war-1

Right and I am saying he does. Floyd has so many different variables though. Cant compare the two fighters. Pac cant do what Floyd did to beat Canelo. Like, at all. They are completely different styles.


Supremo30816

There's a Mexican billionaire who wants this fight to happen back then.[Manny Pacquiao Gets $65 Million Offer to Face Saul Alvarez in Mexico ](https://bleacherreport.com/articles/724378-manny-pacquiao-gets-65-million-offer-to-face-saul-alvarez-in-mexico)


[deleted]

CANELO SMOKES MANNY LIKE A CIGAR ARE YOU KIDDING ME


[deleted]

Then Floyd went & schooled 🎓that same young Lion that Pacquiao ducked 💯


Stiltzkinn

No one asked about Floyd lol.


SugarDynamiteDelight

Legendary w for pac that clearly took a lot out of him


quazimootoo

im surprised he took his foot off the gas pedal, he really was begging the ref to stop the fight. RIP margarito's eye


Alabastrova

Goat


Bruce-7891

Manny is the perfect example of how the "0" doesn't matter. He's had losses here and there throughout his career and is still considered an all time great. Fighters try way to hard to protect their record and refuse to take tough fights.


Stiltzkinn

Anyone with the "0" is so curated.


DANNYBOYLOVER

I’m starting to think it’s less about the 0 and more about the damage on your body. This isn’t the NBA or even NFL. Would you rather get hit 20 times for a million or 100 times for 10 million?


in_Need_of_peace

This was an epic beating, I remember on the PPV team PAC had issue with Margarito drinking coffee before the fight


Reptilianlizard

margarito for me at least is top 5 boxing heels of all time. not only did he have heel energy and had that aggressive style, but also the hand wraps elevated him to the most hatable heel we’ve seen in boxing. all the Ls he’s taken have been absolute bangers of fights and this one is probably my favorite one. such a great fight from manny and prolly my favorite . imo i have manny ranked slightly above floyd in all time rankings. greatest fighter of the era


SpiderZiggs

The greatest Asian martial artist of all time. No, the actor, who shall not be named, doesn't count.


TrinidadCamacho

This fight does make me question the validity of the so called 'cement wraps' of Margarito. People say Marg never got a ko after the scandal but even so he did some serious damage to Pac who was never really the same fighter afterward despite the lopsided scorecards. And we *know* he wasn't using any illegal wraps in this fight. He's always been a volume accumulation knockout fighter anyways. Cotto took plenty of damage in the rematch and after that he was pretty much a spent force.


SquareShapeofEvil

Honestly same, Marg didnt land much but when he did it hurt Manny, I know Margarito almost had Pacquiao down in Round 6. I know Pac is smaller, but still. That plus the fact that no one caught anything while shaking hands with Margarito after the Cotto fight calls it into question. Did he cheat against Cotto? Probably. Is there some reasonable doubt though? Yes. And I agree, while Cotto was winning and probably could’ve danced to a decision victory, it was a bizarre stoppage. They stopped the fight while Marg was starting to find success.


mariotx10

The second fight was starting to turn just like in the first fight, imo, if it wasn’t for the ref stoppage it would’ve ended just like the first again


TrinidadCamacho

Plus he's had distance fights in between his ko streaks prior to Cotto. I mean did he use illegal wraps in the first Cintron fight(where he stopped him in less time than the second time around when he supposedly started using wraps) and stop using them for the more important fights against Clottey and Williams?


slickvik9

The theory is he started using them after the Williams fight


slickvik9

No cotto ran circles around him


Osbre

Didn't cotto say he hit just as hard in the remarch or am i making shit up


slickvik9

I know people that fought and sparred margarito before he got caught and they always said something was odd about his power. It all made sense in the end.


BoxingFan88

Yeah cotto was getting broken down. The fact pacquiao damaged margaritos eye was the only reason we didn't see that ending again


TrinidadCamacho

I wouldn't go that far, in the 9th Marg looked tired and getting outmuscled in the clinches. He was still in the fight and the stoppage was a bit dodgy but I don't think the tide was necessarily turning. My overall point above was that Marg beat Cotto the first time by attrition. The visual damage is no more suspicious than Chavez grinding down Taylor and turning his face into pudding. Actually its pretty much exactly the same circumstance. Plenty of controversy in Taylor-Chavez but I don't here anyone accusing Chavez of using illegal padding. I don't have a complete picture of the scandal but from what I've seen the evidence was flimsy. That's why Marg wasn't jailed for attempted battering and merely suspended before being allowed to box again. If Marg really had cinderblocks a) Cotto would be a vegetable given the number of shots he took and b) Marg's hands would be fucked.


slickvik9

I was there


EnglishButFrench

Is it really an 8th division if the fights not even at that weight class?


[deleted]

[удалено]


EnglishButFrench

The point is it's at a catchweight of 150. Neither man can weigh in at the actual weight of 154. 154 is the only weight I have issue with with Manny. Sure the ring isn't a major belt but it's good enough for me.


migzy1341

True but it almost didn't matter cuz Margarito was well over 160 that night. But his weightcut must've been brutal


[deleted]

Stop hating and just appreciate greatness.


EnglishButFrench

I'm not a pac man hater. It's just how come you can win a belt at 154 when fighting at a catchweight of 150?


[deleted]

He fought Margarito at 150lbs catchweight. Not 160. It's under the 154lb limit. So it's technically a super welterweight fight.


EnglishButFrench

Typo. My bad.


fadeddreams555

The division is not 154lb. It's 148-154lb. Fighters are never obligated to weigh the max of a weight class, just nothing above it.


NotSeeingRace

Someone should have told Margarito. He weighed above 160


EnglishButFrench

The division is 148-154. The Catch weight was 148-150.


fadeddreams555

Yeah, so they were fighting within the limit of super welterweight/light middleweight.


i-piss-excellence32

Sucks that this fight was at 150 because margarito was weak as hell in there. This was peak peds manny pacquiao when he was destroying guys who were bigger. What a beating


A_Supspicious_Asian

Margherito deserved this beating and he still showed up to the ring at 165 lbs so it wasn't like he was weak for this


i-piss-excellence32

He was a huge man and had to weigh 150. You really think he wasn’t weakened?


[deleted]

So many stupid weight classes for the manlets, amd then actual regular sized people are all slammed together. The size differences in HW are insane.


Niyeaux

He's a six division champ. This revisionism people are doing now is very weird. He's an all-time great already, why exaggerate?


[deleted]

50-0 !!!!


navarroouterwear

An over the hill Margarito at a catch weight for a vacant belt?